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	<title>Comments on: Not-So Special Needs</title>
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	<link>http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs/</link>
	<description>A Blog About Teaching in Tough Schools in the UK</description>
	<pubDate>Wed, 27 Aug 2008 23:53:32 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Barry Christmas</title>
		<link>http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs/#comment-1008</link>
		<dc:creator>Barry Christmas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jul 2008 17:18:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs-2/#comment-1008</guid>
		<description>You misunderstand what I mean when I say we all belong on a spectrum.  I mean the spectrum of human behaviour including so-called Aspergers.  Asperger's may be thought by some as nothing more than a modern construct, and by others as a range of normal human behaviours.  When is he a geek and not an Aspie?  There are Aspies who also dislike the suggestion that they are suffering from a disability.  

It's a construct that can help us question the myriad of behaviours that we regard as neuro-typical or neuro non-typical.

What is normal?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You misunderstand what I mean when I say we all belong on a spectrum.  I mean the spectrum of human behaviour including so-called Aspergers.  Asperger&#8217;s may be thought by some as nothing more than a modern construct, and by others as a range of normal human behaviours.  When is he a geek and not an Aspie?  There are Aspies who also dislike the suggestion that they are suffering from a disability.  </p>
<p>It&#8217;s a construct that can help us question the myriad of behaviours that we regard as neuro-typical or neuro non-typical.</p>
<p>What is normal?</p>
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		<title>By: oldandrew</title>
		<link>http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs/#comment-1007</link>
		<dc:creator>oldandrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jul 2008 14:42:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs-2/#comment-1007</guid>
		<description>I wouldn't be able to claim that a condition is fake from the diagnosis.

However, I refuse to class personality traits as conditions, and I've met too many children who have been labelled as being on the autistic spectrum who would be considered to be  charming, charismatic extroverts if they went to a Star Trek convention, or were lecturing in a university mathematics department. Not fitting in is not a disease.

And, no, our behaviour doesn't put us on a spectrum. That's like saying our clothes put us on a spectrum. Appropriate behaviour, like appropriate clothing, depends on circumstances or even opinion. While we might be able to identify extreme behaviour (or eccentric clothing) that is never likely to fit in, that does not mean that everyone is on an objective scale of "fitting-in-ness".</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I wouldn&#8217;t be able to claim that a condition is fake from the diagnosis.</p>
<p>However, I refuse to class personality traits as conditions, and I&#8217;ve met too many children who have been labelled as being on the autistic spectrum who would be considered to be  charming, charismatic extroverts if they went to a Star Trek convention, or were lecturing in a university mathematics department. Not fitting in is not a disease.</p>
<p>And, no, our behaviour doesn&#8217;t put us on a spectrum. That&#8217;s like saying our clothes put us on a spectrum. Appropriate behaviour, like appropriate clothing, depends on circumstances or even opinion. While we might be able to identify extreme behaviour (or eccentric clothing) that is never likely to fit in, that does not mean that everyone is on an objective scale of &#8220;fitting-in-ness&#8221;.</p>
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		<title>By: Barry Christmas</title>
		<link>http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs/#comment-1005</link>
		<dc:creator>Barry Christmas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jul 2008 11:47:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs-2/#comment-1005</guid>
		<description>We all exist on a human behavioural spectrum.  We shouldn't just write-off Aspergers because it seems like a fancy label or construct.  It was after all first identified in the 1940's by Dr Hans Asperger, so it isn't that new.  There are behavioural traits that can cause issues with understanding and interaction.  

I think perhaps you should be a little more agnostic.  Especially since these disorders are seriously a minority even in the toughest sink schools.  And yes, I have worked in places every bit as bad as you so brilliantly describe.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We all exist on a human behavioural spectrum.  We shouldn&#8217;t just write-off Aspergers because it seems like a fancy label or construct.  It was after all first identified in the 1940&#8217;s by Dr Hans Asperger, so it isn&#8217;t that new.  There are behavioural traits that can cause issues with understanding and interaction.  </p>
<p>I think perhaps you should be a little more agnostic.  Especially since these disorders are seriously a minority even in the toughest sink schools.  And yes, I have worked in places every bit as bad as you so brilliantly describe.</p>
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		<title>By: Barry Christmas</title>
		<link>http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs/#comment-1004</link>
		<dc:creator>Barry Christmas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Jul 2008 11:42:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs-2/#comment-1004</guid>
		<description>If by fake autism you mean the so-called pervasive development disorders (PDD's) like Aspergers, then be careful.  Are you saying they don't exist?  I think that would be presumptuous and arrogant given the research and evidence to the contrary.  Better to be an agnostic methinks, even with PDD's like ADD/ADHD.

Mostly agree with you everywhere else.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>If by fake autism you mean the so-called pervasive development disorders (PDD&#8217;s) like Aspergers, then be careful.  Are you saying they don&#8217;t exist?  I think that would be presumptuous and arrogant given the research and evidence to the contrary.  Better to be an agnostic methinks, even with PDD&#8217;s like ADD/ADHD.</p>
<p>Mostly agree with you everywhere else.</p>
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		<title>By: oldandrew</title>
		<link>http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs/#comment-759</link>
		<dc:creator>oldandrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 03 Apr 2008 06:05:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs-2/#comment-759</guid>
		<description>I did mention that there are students who are actually autistic. But  most kids that teachers are told are on the autistic spectrum have no problem other than either a) being a bit geeky or b) being badly behaved. Neither condition should be classed as a form of autism. The former should join the chess team the latter should be punished. Calling them autistic is an insult to those who have genuine difficulties due to autism.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I did mention that there are students who are actually autistic. But  most kids that teachers are told are on the autistic spectrum have no problem other than either a) being a bit geeky or b) being badly behaved. Neither condition should be classed as a form of autism. The former should join the chess team the latter should be punished. Calling them autistic is an insult to those who have genuine difficulties due to autism.</p>
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		<title>By: Zoe</title>
		<link>http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs/#comment-758</link>
		<dc:creator>Zoe</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 02 Apr 2008 20:20:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs-2/#comment-758</guid>
		<description>I just wanted to say that some cases of autism or aspergers syndrome are just used as an excuse, but there are some people who generally suffer from autism or aspergers syndrome.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just wanted to say that some cases of autism or aspergers syndrome are just used as an excuse, but there are some people who generally suffer from autism or aspergers syndrome.</p>
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		<title>By: oldandrew</title>
		<link>http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs/#comment-545</link>
		<dc:creator>oldandrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jun 2007 11:21:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs-2/#comment-545</guid>
		<description>"It's very handy that whatever a student has experienced, or whatever a student prefers, or whatever a student feels, that they have to follow your rules regardless of the impact of your rules upon them because the student is immoral."

Erm.... Where did I mention rules?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;It&#8217;s very handy that whatever a student has experienced, or whatever a student prefers, or whatever a student feels, that they have to follow your rules regardless of the impact of your rules upon them because the student is immoral.&#8221;</p>
<p>Erm&#8230;. Where did I mention rules?</p>
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		<title>By: Newsisgood</title>
		<link>http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs/#comment-544</link>
		<dc:creator>Newsisgood</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jun 2007 11:01:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs-2/#comment-544</guid>
		<description>"They are stopping their friends from learning and wasting the teacher's time, which makes the action incredibly selfish, and yes, morally wrong."

It's very handy that whatever a student has experienced, or whatever a student prefers, or whatever a student feels, that they have to follow your rules regardless of the impact of your rules upon them because the &lt;b&gt;student&lt;/b&gt; is immoral.


I would question whether rules are always correct, teachers are always correct, or schools are always correct.  I don't think your system can cope with that, and that is why it would not work in practise.

Lily's comment reminds me of John Dewey's approach to education, which centers on the student's experience and consider them at the center.  While it does prioritise the student as a person, and the student's experiences, it emphasises that teachers have the training and duty to understand which experiences are preferable for the student.  So I would similarly argue that you can offer a student-centred approach WITHOUT allowing a foolish route of &lt;i&gt;'anything goes'&lt;/i&gt;.  And such an approach is infinitely preferable in comparision to a heavy-handed 'nothing goes' which consistently seems to emphasise the sins of the students.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;They are stopping their friends from learning and wasting the teacher&#8217;s time, which makes the action incredibly selfish, and yes, morally wrong.&#8221;</p>
<p>It&#8217;s very handy that whatever a student has experienced, or whatever a student prefers, or whatever a student feels, that they have to follow your rules regardless of the impact of your rules upon them because the <b>student</b> is immoral.</p>
<p>I would question whether rules are always correct, teachers are always correct, or schools are always correct.  I don&#8217;t think your system can cope with that, and that is why it would not work in practise.</p>
<p>Lily&#8217;s comment reminds me of John Dewey&#8217;s approach to education, which centers on the student&#8217;s experience and consider them at the center.  While it does prioritise the student as a person, and the student&#8217;s experiences, it emphasises that teachers have the training and duty to understand which experiences are preferable for the student.  So I would similarly argue that you can offer a student-centred approach WITHOUT allowing a foolish route of <i>&#8216;anything goes&#8217;</i>.  And such an approach is infinitely preferable in comparision to a heavy-handed &#8216;nothing goes&#8217; which consistently seems to emphasise the sins of the students.</p>
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		<title>By: Lucy</title>
		<link>http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs/#comment-543</link>
		<dc:creator>Lucy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 15 Jun 2007 07:32:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs-2/#comment-543</guid>
		<description>Very interesting piece - thank you for writing so clearly on the subject of how our schools are today.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Very interesting piece - thank you for writing so clearly on the subject of how our schools are today.</p>
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		<title>By: lilyofthefield</title>
		<link>http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs/#comment-542</link>
		<dc:creator>lilyofthefield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jun 2007 22:20:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2007/06/10/not-so-special-needs-2/#comment-542</guid>
		<description>Despite Tone's zeal for personalised education, it is not feasible, not possible, that every lesson can be to each child's individual preferences.  Tough.  Shut up and put up with it.  And if you won't, you will be punished in a way that is meaningful to you.

I didn't allow my children to eat nothing but chocolate and chips and stay up till midnight.  That would have been their preference, their taste.  It would have made life a lot easier for me.  You can't give in to children's momentary childish, ill-judged, unwise whims.  Adults have a responsibility to choose what best for them and if they don't much like it from time to time, they will have to learn to deal with it.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Despite Tone&#8217;s zeal for personalised education, it is not feasible, not possible, that every lesson can be to each child&#8217;s individual preferences.  Tough.  Shut up and put up with it.  And if you won&#8217;t, you will be punished in a way that is meaningful to you.</p>
<p>I didn&#8217;t allow my children to eat nothing but chocolate and chips and stay up till midnight.  That would have been their preference, their taste.  It would have made life a lot easier for me.  You can&#8217;t give in to children&#8217;s momentary childish, ill-judged, unwise whims.  Adults have a responsibility to choose what best for them and if they don&#8217;t much like it from time to time, they will have to learn to deal with it.</p>
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