Comments on: The Behaviour Management Database http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2006/11/30/the-behaviour-management-database/ A Blog About Teaching in Tough Schools in the UK Sat, 11 Oct 2008 13:53:11 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.5.1 By: arwen http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2006/11/30/the-behaviour-management-database/#comment-360 arwen Tue, 02 Jan 2007 14:30:32 +0000 http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2006/11/30/the-behaviour-management-database/#comment-360 I have worked in a school where one of these databases was used as a tool to count the amount of "on call" referrals were made by each teacher. I fell foul of this system due to the fact that my classroom contained the only telephone in the department. This meant that all "on call" requests for the department plus neighbouring classrooms were logged as coming from me. I was then constantly badgered about following up incidents regarding children I had never even heard of, and was even hauled in front of the deputy head. When I explained, the DH was very apologetic, but the problem continues to this day. One ridiculous HOY still insists that I set detentions for every "on call" request coming from my phone. Needless to say, i don't!! I have worked in a school where one of these databases was used as a tool to count the amount of “on call” referrals were made by each teacher.
I fell foul of this system due to the fact that my classroom contained the only telephone in the department. This meant that all “on call” requests for the department plus neighbouring classrooms were logged as coming from me. I was then constantly badgered about following up incidents regarding children I had never even heard of, and was even hauled in front of the deputy head. When I explained, the DH was very apologetic, but the problem continues to this day. One ridiculous HOY still insists that I set detentions for every “on call” request coming from my phone. Needless to say, i don’t!!

]]> By: John B http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2006/11/30/the-behaviour-management-database/#comment-359 John B Sun, 24 Dec 2006 12:54:28 +0000 http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2006/11/30/the-behaviour-management-database/#comment-359 Sounds all too familiar. Having spent 4 years in rough Aussie schools and then almost 3 very miserable years in UK gaols (sorry schools) I gave up and left to the international market. I felt then, and even more so now, that the "developed" world is moving in the wrong direction in Education. This was confirmed by so many others in the good overseas schools with similar stories from the US, UK, Canada and other so called "developed" countries. OMG! What a break, what a change! Finally I could teach the way teaching was meant to happen. Now as I teach in different parts of the world on contract (of course using a bit of common-sense in which schools I applied for) has been a blessing. To find that there are real schools out there, where kids respect teachers, teachers teach and kids learn, has been totally uplifting. To my beleaguered colleagues I suggest, do it for a few years for the experience, write to a few useless politicians, ring up the press, be a troublemaker for a while, then when you discover it's all a waste of time, pack up. Either move to the international circuit, whilst using a bit of prudence, or, change areas to work in a definitely better school, or, become the Prime Minister or at least Minister for Education (well no, not really likely to happen is it?), or perhaps just plain change careers. You were intelligent enough to get where you are; you deserve better than to be abused by the retards of society which have been let run amuck by spineless leaders and administrators. You can have better out there. It is there. I found it, it exists. Sounds all too familiar. Having spent 4 years in rough Aussie schools and then almost 3 very miserable years in UK gaols (sorry schools) I gave up and left to the international market. I felt then, and even more so now, that the “developed” world is moving in the wrong direction in Education. This was confirmed by so many others in the good overseas schools with similar stories from the US, UK, Canada and other so called “developed” countries. OMG! What a break, what a change! Finally I could teach the way teaching was meant to happen. Now as I teach in different parts of the world on contract (of course using a bit of common-sense in which schools I applied for) has been a blessing. To find that there are real schools out there, where kids respect teachers, teachers teach and kids learn, has been totally uplifting. To my beleaguered colleagues I suggest, do it for a few years for the experience, write to a few useless politicians, ring up the press, be a troublemaker for a while, then when you discover it’s all a waste of time, pack up.

Either move to the international circuit, whilst using a bit of prudence, or, change areas to work in a definitely better school, or, become the Prime Minister or at least Minister for Education (well no, not really likely to happen is it?), or perhaps just plain change careers. You were intelligent enough to get where you are; you deserve better than to be abused by the retards of society which have been let run amuck by spineless leaders and administrators. You can have better out there. It is there. I found it, it exists.

]]> By: Eureka! http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2006/11/30/the-behaviour-management-database/#comment-358 Eureka! Wed, 06 Dec 2006 06:53:59 +0000 http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2006/11/30/the-behaviour-management-database/#comment-358 News is Good - I like you. News is Good - I like you.

]]> By: lilyofthefield http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2006/11/30/the-behaviour-management-database/#comment-357 lilyofthefield Sun, 03 Dec 2006 16:59:41 +0000 http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2006/11/30/the-behaviour-management-database/#comment-357 Elaine, most schools will exclude for a couple of weeks for assault on a pupil (make that a week for an assault on a member of staff), dealing on the premises, theft, vandalism, arson (all with incontrovertible CCTV proof) because it makes them look as if they're Doing Something. But what the hell they have to do to be permanently excluded is beyond me. Attempted murder doesn't seem to guarantee it, as a teacher in a school I was on supply at last week proved: a kid set fire to her hair with a lighter, caused a serious burn to her neck and got a three-day exclusion. The teacher was assured she wouldn't have to teach this girl again, but lo! first day back she got a cover lesson and there the grinning little cow was. Elaine, most schools will exclude for a couple of weeks for assault on a pupil (make that a week for an assault on a member of staff), dealing on the premises, theft, vandalism, arson (all with incontrovertible CCTV proof) because it makes them look as if they’re Doing Something. But what the hell they have to do to be permanently excluded is beyond me. Attempted murder doesn’t seem to guarantee it, as a teacher in a school I was on supply at last week proved: a kid set fire to her hair with a lighter, caused a serious burn to her neck and got a three-day exclusion. The teacher was assured she wouldn’t have to teach this girl again, but lo! first day back she got a cover lesson and there the grinning little cow was.

]]> By: ElaineC http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2006/11/30/the-behaviour-management-database/#comment-356 ElaineC Thu, 30 Nov 2006 22:29:34 +0000 http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2006/11/30/the-behaviour-management-database/#comment-356 You are so right in the lessons you draw from having databases of behaviour in schools. If nothing is done about the incidents all this system does is present the teacher with one more time consuming, administrative task. Anyone know exactly what it does take for a pupil to get permanently excluded now? Heard of an incident last week where a kid had been so badly injured by another that he had to have a plate inserted in his head. The violent student was excluded for a fortnight and afterwards given a mentor who according to my reliable source, "Does all his coursework for him." As other kids in the school see it the boy received rewards for his dreadful behaviour. You are so right in the lessons you draw from having databases of behaviour in schools. If nothing is done about the incidents all this system does is present the teacher with one more time consuming, administrative task.

Anyone know exactly what it does take for a pupil to get permanently excluded now? Heard of an incident last week where a kid had been so badly injured by another that he had to have a plate inserted in his head. The violent student was excluded for a fortnight and afterwards given a mentor who according to my reliable source, “Does all his coursework for him.” As other kids in the school see it the boy received rewards for his dreadful behaviour.

]]> By: News is Good http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2006/11/30/the-behaviour-management-database/#comment-355 News is Good Thu, 30 Nov 2006 19:09:17 +0000 http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2006/11/30/the-behaviour-management-database/#comment-355 It is amusing to note that any war-tale of a bad school involves the immense reluctance to deal with problematic students, because the repercussions of the statistics of expulsion inevitably affect the school as a whole, and therefore the individual careers of those in charge. It is not a system of education in these cases, it is a system for all involved to get away with as much as possible by doing as little as possible - for both students and staff. This is what happens when we are obsessed with results and make the effect of dealing with problems to a negative result; a great big carpet over every school under which problems are pushed, for everyone who can to walk away from as quickly as possible. Education must have as its focus the student, each and every one of them. Focus on a statistical abstraction of the results of assessment of each student reduces education to what is practically its antithesis, brainless training in meaningless indicators of worth. It is amusing to note that any war-tale of a bad school involves the immense reluctance to deal with problematic students, because the repercussions of the statistics of expulsion inevitably affect the school as a whole, and therefore the individual careers of those in charge. It is not a system of education in these cases, it is a system for all involved to get away with as much as possible by doing as little as possible - for both students and staff. This is what happens when we are obsessed with results and make the effect of dealing with problems to a negative result; a great big carpet over every school under which problems are pushed, for everyone who can to walk away from as quickly as possible.

Education must have as its focus the student, each and every one of them. Focus on a statistical abstraction of the results of assessment of each student reduces education to what is practically its antithesis, brainless training in meaningless indicators of worth.

]]> By: lilyofthefield http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2006/11/30/the-behaviour-management-database/#comment-354 lilyofthefield Thu, 30 Nov 2006 18:39:55 +0000 http://oldandrew.edublogs.org/2006/11/30/the-behaviour-management-database/#comment-354 We ran exactly the same thing at Hell High. In the same way you don't fatten a pig by weighing it, you don't make the slightest difference to anyone's behaviour by recording it. Its main uses were firstly to gain an overview of behaviour patterns - e.g. we went early into the one-lesson-after-lunch pattern because more incidents occurred after lunch than before - and secondly, to print them all off as incontrovertible evidence of prolonged and persistent wrongdoing when trying to get a kid permanently excluded or referred to the PRU. Shortly before I left, some other schools had shown an interest and we had a meeting to compare notes. One serious shortcoming was that whereas at Hell High, minor incidents so frequent as to be unpolicable e.g. swearing at the teacher, kicking the door, shouting out, were never recorded and were only logged when they reached "assaulted another pupil", "racist comment", "threw chair" level, other schools more fortunately placed had such heinous crimes as "wearing large earrings" and "interrupting teacher" on theirs. We ran exactly the same thing at Hell High. In the same way you don’t fatten a pig by weighing it, you don’t make the slightest difference to anyone’s behaviour by recording it.

Its main uses were firstly to gain an overview of behaviour patterns - e.g. we went early into the one-lesson-after-lunch pattern because more incidents occurred after lunch than before - and secondly, to print them all off as incontrovertible evidence of prolonged and persistent wrongdoing when trying to get a kid permanently excluded or referred to the PRU.

Shortly before I left, some other schools had shown an interest and we had a meeting to compare notes. One serious shortcoming was that whereas at Hell High, minor incidents so frequent as to be unpolicable e.g. swearing at the teacher, kicking the door, shouting out, were never recorded and were only logged when they reached “assaulted another pupil”, “racist comment”, “threw chair” level, other schools more fortunately placed had such heinous crimes as “wearing large earrings” and “interrupting teacher” on theirs.

]]>